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Originally Posted by Med911
Long winded, but lets see if I can answer you.
Fair enough... BJP ki jai!
I have met MANY Indian Hindus in my life. But I never claimed to know you. What do know is that I can infrences regarding India behavor in certain specific situations, because I have seen how you have behaved in such situations in the past.
Secondly, Muslims in India are very different from Muslims in Pakistan. Even within Pakistan, the different ethnic groups are very different. In fact. I would venture to guess that you dont even know Indian Muslims as they are even more diverse inIndian then in Pakistan.
So your claim that you know Pakistanis based on knowing Indian Muslims, doesnt hold water.
You dont know Islam very well either. Islam and Democracy are not incompatible. You possibly heard some khutba from some extremist in India and think that must be the end all...
So please, dont debate religion with me. You dont know anything about Islam either.
No, I have seen democracy first hand. So I am atleast qualified to judge democracy in India. And hence I do 
Its not me who needs to give you a chance. Im not the one stopping your country from investigating and prosecuting the culprits...
Im sure there are many stains on the Kahlifat, but this discussion isnt about Islam or Khalifat.
And no, thankfully we havent had the same kind of riots on the scale you see in Indian.
We have certainly had criminals and terrorists who commit such crimes, but the genral populus lives in peace. in India the riots are commited by the general population.
And m glad India is prosecuting some of the criminals. Even if the chief archtect was re elected.
As for Muslims in India... Here is a good article from te NY times.
MEMO FROM INDIA; Report Shows Muslims Near Bottom of Social Ladder - New York Times
Here is what your own PM Monmohan Singh said... FROM THE ARTICLE-
'The community is relatively poor, more illiterate, has lower access to education, LOWER REPRESENTATION in public- and private-sector jobs and lower availability of bank credit for self-employment. In urban areas, the community mostly lives in slums characterized by poor municipal infrastructure.''
Well if they cant do it in Hindu dominated areas, then that just proves the point.
And you where Hindus live in Pakistan 
There are many in Karachi, but I honestly dont think anything would happen to them if they supported India in cricket or raised an Indian flag. Maybe I am being naive, but I dont think the Hindu will be killed. Pakistanis arent that rabidly nationalist... |
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Long winded, but lets see if I can answer you.
Fair enough... BJP ki jai!
I have met MANY Indian Hindus in my life. But I never claimed to know you. What do know is that I can infrences regarding India behavor in certain specific situations, because I have seen how you have behaved in such situations in the past.
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U might have met many Indian hindus, but U must not have lived with them as family members and friendly neibhours. I can boast of that. I have passed 25 years of my life in a muslim dominated city and locality.
If U are hinting at very few incidents of riots which occured when Pakistan victory was celebrated by muslims, than Plz count how many times Pakistan has won against India and how many times riots did break out. U will find ur conclusion. Each victory of Pakistan is widely celebrated by a particular section of muslims in most part of India. We have been living with it.
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Secondly, Muslims in India are very different from Muslims in Pakistan. Even within Pakistan, the different ethnic groups are very different. In fact. I would venture to guess that you dont even know Indian Muslims as they are even more diverse inIndian then in Pakistan.
So your claim that you know Pakistanis based on knowing Indian Muslims, doesnt hold water.
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Well how muslims in India are different than Pakistani muslims? Dont they offer namaz? dont they hold long processions on moharram and holy prophet's birthday? are they anything less fanatic in terms of religion? So how diversity among Indian muslims can stop me from knowing them? Plz add to my knowledge that how Indian muslims are different than their pakistani counterpart.
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You dont know Islam very well either. Islam and Democracy are not incompatible. You possibly heard some khutba from some extremist in India and think that must be the end all...
So please, dont debate religion with me. You dont know anything about Islam either.
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I might not know about Islam VERY WELL, still I assure U that I know it quiet well and Alhamdullillah I m studying it and trying to learn it more and more. And ur statement that Islam and democracy are compitable proves that U too dont know Islam VERY WELL. It was not some extremist in India who claimed that democracy is equivalant to major SHIRK, rather it was famous Pakistani Islamic scholar Israr sahib. U can confirm it urself.
Plz dont claim again that I donk know anything about Islam. If U have any doubt, than debate is always a mannered way out.
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No, I have seen democracy first hand. So I am atleast qualified to judge democracy in India. And hence I do
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I m not going to contest ur claim, but I had thrown a rather harsh allegation at Pakistan and Pakistanis that they decieved the very cause for which Pakistan was formed. U are yet to dismiss it or accept it. Will U now?
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Its not me who needs to give you a chance. Im not the one stopping your country from investigating and prosecuting the culprits...
Im sure there are many stains on the Kahlifat, but this discussion isnt about Islam or Khalifat.
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Well as I said procecution has already been done in some cases, in some cases it were victims themselves who took money from accused and became hostile, (U can ask for references if u wish), and investigation is still on in some cases. Lets hope that guilty are brought to book and are punished accordingly.
I appreciate ur admission regarding stains on khilafat. and discussion isnt about khilafat or Islam either, but all I wanted to say was when muslims can kill muslims under the best system of khilafat and Islam, than anything can happen in fake systems like democracy. But see how inspite of ppls of two opposite faith living together and enjoying full religious independence ( as seen rare in the world), India is rather peaceful than even Ur country. U have used heavy ammuniation against muslims in mosques, U have dropped bombs in madarsas, and what not. (pl ask for reference if U wish).
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And no, thankfully we havent had the same kind of riots on the scale you see in Indian.
We have certainly had criminals and terrorists who commit such crimes, but the genral populus lives in peace. in India the riots are commited by the general population.
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Well what U are saying? havent U have imposition of curfew in ur cities due to riots? What is difference between a Pakistani riot and and Indian riot? hasnt innocent muslims died in riots in ur country? are U kidding with me and the forum? what is ur appropriate scale which U are claiming?
Its criminals and terrorists in India even who commit such crime of rioting. general populace in India live in more peace than anywhere in the world or its neibhourhood. And had general population been commiting riots in India than there would have been no muslim living here. Hindu here outnumber muslims by 7 to 1.
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As for Muslims in India... Here is a good article from te NY times.
MEMO FROM INDIA; Report Shows Muslims Near Bottom of Social Ladder - New York Times
Here is what your own PM Monmohan Singh said... FROM THE ARTICLE-
'The community is relatively poor, more illiterate, has lower access to education, LOWER REPRESENTATION in public- and private-sector jobs and lower availability of bank credit for self-employment. In urban areas, the community mostly lives in slums characterized by poor municipal infrastructure.''
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Not only In India, Muslims over the world are relatively poor as compared to hindus, provided u take into account wealth produced through skills and industry and not by natural resources or property. Same is in case of education. Hindus are way ahead universally by muslims in this field too.
LOWER REPRESENTATION in private and public sector job is because of less awareness of education among muslims. But things are changing fast Alhamdullillah. Avaiablity of bank credit is related with repayment of loans. Unfortunately muslims have been not so good in repayment in the past, so banks take a cautious stand while distrituting loans. Hindus too have loan crunch if their repayment history is not up to mark. Its pure business brother. Regarding living in slums, it is related by wealth. There are wealthy muslims who live in palaces throughout India. And hindus too live in sllums if they cant afford a better accomodation for themselves. Infrastructure is not selectively
bad for any community. Pl be realistic and face hard truth.
Peace.