X2/Fraudia moderating Pak Affairs (2 threads merged)

[Spock]

You nailed it. The College administration is smart, they are taking precautionary measures because these talibob nut jobs can only make suicide attacks or disturb peace or assassinate people but certain idiots and mindless MQM thugs are trying to imply the college is taking orders from Taliban.

So Mr. Fraudia/X2 removed the post above and this is the explanation he put in. I read it because he posted it in the wrong place at first:

irrrelevant posts, and attacks on other posters as idiots and mindless MQM thugs.
lets make sure not every thread turns into the same old thing.

Now he on another thread with his other nick 'Mister Sinister' posted the following after my post where I disagreed with the topic at hand. Now either both of us are referring to guppies as idiots, or both of us aren't, but my posts get moved, and his own posts stay.

Violence explodes across North Karachi

Originally Posted by Mister Sinister

indeed, it did look like an attempt to create a conflict. luckily it seems like most people are smart and did not fall for it, idiots did and do as we can see. Thank god they are in a minority.

A while ago, I was warned for referring to Musharraf as Busharraf, and got a warning from a mod Mad_Scientist, while in the same exact thread he (Mr. Fraudia) referred to Benazir Bhutto as Benazir Butthole.

Now firstly, let the mods do their jobs; they are quite good at it. Secondly, on countless occasions some posters have been referred to as Talibans or jihad lovers etc (just recently), why do you choose to ignore all that? Out of the blue, you come and take my posts out because I wrote 'mqm thugs'. Considering those were direct attacks, and mine wasn't even a direct attack isnt this hypocrisy? Personal prejudices?

[teggy]

A mere misunderstanding. Political parties/ideological entities are all fair game when it comes to criticism. Please continue to post in Pakistan Affairs/World Affairs and share your perspective so long as it is done within the framework of guidelines.

PA/WA tolerates a vast range of opinions, points of view, and perspective. To share and discuss is one way for us to learn from each other, and perhaps distinguish the good and the bad.

I apologize for any misunderstanding that may have taken place. I assure you there will be no favoritism or unjust moderating.

PS: I am going to review the concern brought forth, and you will be notified after i have gathered information as to why the posts were removed. You will be contacted, and the matter resolved in a timely manner.

[Spock]

^ Thanks teggy, that's how I would expect things to be done. I did not call any guppie in particular a jihadi or a MQM supporter. I hope it is brought back or otherwise Mr. Sinister/x2 should move his post as well.

Also, people who assume criticizing their party means criticism on themselves should be strong enough to handle some blows like men. It seems like criticizing the Taliban is welcomed, but criticizing the MQM is strongly discouraged here.

[TLK]

Spock, thanks for the comments. I will let X2 come and explain what he was trying to say. Maybe that will remove some confusion.

[X2]

point #1) Me moderating:

Mods are doing their jobs,

had I made a decision, I would have moved it to total trash, yet I moved it to RF for the mods of pak affairs to deal with it, gave my views on it, and mods are completely free to disagree and bring it back, I have since spoken to teggy about it and it is his call.

#2) My post

The post spock is referring to I had already explained very clearly. That I was calling all
individuals involved in the riots in Karachi as idiots and that it was good that majority of people did not fall for it.

Let me post it here.

"May 1st, 2009, 12:36 PM #35 (permalink) [ Disemvowel ]
Mister Sinister
Member

Join Date: Nov 4, 2007 - 6:21 pm
Posts: 179 I clearly meant the people engaging in violence in Karachi. and thank god that they are in a minority otherwise the clashes in teh city would be worse."


#3) spocks post

Spocks words were the following

"certain idiots and mindless MQM thugs are trying to imply the college is taking orders from Taliban. "

In the thread I saw no reference to any MQM leaders commenting on the KC college situation and thus took it as an attack on the members posting.

If spock is saying he was referring to MQM party members, I have no issues, call that party whatever you want and bring the post back.

Out of personal curiosity, I would however like to see where exactly were MQM members implying that the college is bowing to pressure from the taleban, because I did not see that as part of the discussion there or in the news really.

I think I have made my actions and position clear.

It is up to mods, CM etc to decide.
which was the intent from the get go.

[teggy]

I will reiterate it was a matter of misunderstanding that a member's posts were deliberately being targeted. I will reassure you that all posts moved/removed are present in Review (Spock you know that!), and will be reviewed by the team of concerned moderators along with myself.

Let us try to not let misunderstandings get the best of us. I will request that you continue posting in Pakistan Affairs/World Affairs, and should you see any questionable posts, please report them. Often PMing the moderator(s) or reporting a post is the fastest method to request proper action.

Thanks for the understanding Spock, and Thank you X2 for clarifying as well.

[Spock]

The other thread was closed so I am starting a new one.

So Mr. Fraudia/X2 says he didnt refer to any guppies, fair enough, maybe I misunderstood him, and he clarified later on. Good. But why am I not given a chance to clarify and my posts end up in review? Did it occur to you that I could be misunderstood by you too? Now that I have clarified, can I have the posts back in PA? There were other questions that are unanswered, about all the references to some guppies as taliban terrorists, lovers etc going unchecked too but I guess I just want my post back now that I have clarified myself, in all fairness.

[teggy]

The posts are under review by moderators, and as soon as a decision has been reached regarding them you will be notified. Either a moderator or I will notify you of the fate of the posts in questions. All moderators' input is necessary to reach a consensus.

I would request you to bear with us, and remain patient please. And thanks again for your understanding, and patience.

[bitter_reality]

why all material which goes against the political ideology of some mods get under review?

Can we not have freedom of expression here?

I request moderators of Pakistan affair forum to be more democratic in their moderating

[bitter_reality]

I request the mods of Pakistani affair forum to make a new rule so all know about it. The rule should be

" Don't post anything thats against political ideas of the Mods. Boot lick the mods to have your threads posted or else...they will be taken for review and ultimately be removed"

and yes if you complain too much...and show consistency in defending your own political ideas.....then the mods have the right to send you warnings and infractions in private messages

[TLK]

Teggy, since Spock is feeling that his issue is not resolved, I am merging his another thread with this and re-opening this thread.

Also Teggy, if you see any irrelevant posts, be it from Mods or Members, remove them. Keep this thread clean and on topic. Bitter_Reality's posts are OK (or any other member's) as long as they stay on the topic.

In fact, lets keep the rule for all the threads of this section. CMs can remove any irrelevant post so we resolve concerns and issues rather then starting fight between mods and members

[bitter_reality]

I would also suggest the following modertating strategy


Give people more freedom to express their ideas. Its ok not to agree with moderators. Modertors should not take it personally if some ordinary member like me disagrees with them.

Infractions should be restricted to vulgarity, use of swear words and calling bad names only. Incase if somebody doesn't agree with your ideology and you think that he is politically opposite ...then please don't give him/her warnings or infractions.

Also, Picking up on certain members should be discouraged. Too much hawkish approach kills the essence of discussion . Be more liberal in moderation and don't make it a court of law.

Unnecessary reviewing of posts for removal should be discouraged. If the post is not good it will die on its own and won't get much hits.

Lets be more liberal towards accepting other's political standings.


Thanks

[bitter_reality]

Also, Moderators should not entertain childish complains of forum members to ban their opponents.

Moderators should keep an eye on forum members who flatter and lobby banning of others through underground conspiracies and dirty politics

Word to word disssection and scrutiny of sentences for picking up faults should be discouraged.

As, in this case i think Spocks post was examined under a microscope, Moderators should avoid unnecessary fault findings

[teggy]

Points well-taken. Thank you bitter_reality. We always strive to facilitate the members' requests to the extent possible.

[teggy]

Spock, please check your PM.

[Spock]

Originally Posted by bitter_reality

As, in this case i think Spocks post was examined under a microscope,

That reminds me of a revolutionary poet I revere a lot. Remember Habib Jalib? He wrote against every single dictator till the day he died, and spent most of his time behind bars on cooked charges. Even if he uttered just their names alone, he was sent to prison.

Deep jis ka sirf mehellaat hi main jalay,
Chand logon ki khushyon ko lay ker chalay,
Wo jo saye main har maslihat kay palay;
Aisay dastoor ko, Subh-e-bay noor ko,
Main naheen maanta, Main naheen jaanta.

[Spock]

Originally Posted by teggy

Spock, please check your PM.

thanks bro, I got it... issue is resolved as far as im concerned...

[teggy]

You're very welcome. Thank you for your patience bro.

Thread closed.