barat and valima merged..

Degas · Apr 3rd, 2005, 11:48 PM

Recently, i attended a wedding in Lahore (my friends brothers') with only 2 days functions.. Mehndi and (barat - Valima ) combined.. both sides paid equally for the 2 functions.. was good for friends like us to go out for only 2 days instead of 3 but the traditional barat thging was missing.. i heard this is picking up in big cities in pakistan..

Golden Scorpion · Apr 5th, 2005, 01:41 AM

Tehnicaly Barat and Walima cannot be Done on same day...

Who ever Do it, then its Baraat + Dawat... not Walima.

Walima is Sunat-e-Nabwi... and You can call it Walima when... in Law words... THE MARRIAGE HAS BEEN CONSUMATED..

Mem Sahib · Apr 5th, 2005, 08:30 AM

mmmm Golden Scorpion

Ira · Apr 5th, 2005, 10:27 AM

I had a friend in Canada do that too, both him and his wife are from Pakistan though. So i thought it might be a foriegn thing. I guess not if it is also happening in Pak.
I agree with GScorpion's first part of his post. Abt the walima being an indication of consummation of a marriage, i am not so sure about. I am sure Islam doesnt dictate for us WHEN to consummate a shadi. Also i am not married yet but i am sure some people wouldnt wnat to consummate on the nikah day itself.
I think if i remember correctly the islamic POV on walima is sort of letting everyone in the family know taht the dude got married.

Sara516 · Apr 5th, 2005, 08:08 PM

okay if that's the case what if they'd consummated their relationship before htey got married? it's a stretch yes but still a possibility..

AQ · Apr 5th, 2005, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sara516

okay if that's the case what if they'd consummated their relationship before htey got married? it's a stretch yes but still a possibility..

it's called Zina Bil Raza and is one of the sins.

Degas · Apr 5th, 2005, 11:46 PM

true.. I think they must had called it daawat.. and next day gave a small party to only close family as walima..

Majestic · Apr 6th, 2005, 12:03 PM

Whats barat?

Starsky · Apr 6th, 2005, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Golden Scorpion

Walima is Sunat-e-Nabwi... and You can call it Walima when... in Law words... THE MARRIAGE HAS BEEN CONSUMATED..

Thats not true. The Walima is basically a feast provided by the Groom's side, it has not bearing on consumation which is a private matter.

Sara516 · Apr 6th, 2005, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anwaar Qureshi

it's called Zina Bil Raza and is one of the sins.

Right. What if the girl has her period during the wdding and they cannot consummate the marriage as a result? Acutally, okay dumb question but does menstruation affect nikkah in any way? Or what if htey' just choose not to have sex on the wedding night for whatever reason? For something that is supposed to stay strictly between husband and wife, sex sure does become a public thing during weddings....

Majestic · Apr 6th, 2005, 10:45 PM

can someone tell me what the hell are you guys talking about? And Sara menstruation does not affect nikkah in any way shape or form.

AQ · Apr 6th, 2005, 11:22 PM

Majestic in simple terms, baraat is a word when groom goes to bride's place for Aqd or Nikkah

and I dunno what is a word for VALIMA in Arabic or if it is itself an Arabic word. But Valima is a sunnah for what I know.
clear?

Sara516 · Apr 6th, 2005, 11:53 PM

valima is sunnah? i thot it was farz...

larki · Apr 7th, 2005, 10:25 AM

where the heck do people get the idea that the walima can only be held once the marriage is consummated?? as starsky pointed out, the walima is just the reception that the guy is supposed to throw and it also serves the purpose of "announcing" the marriage.

majestic, there are several wedding events in pakistani culture. apart from the mehndi (henna party) and mayun (a party where they rub yellow herbal cleanser on the bride), the nikah can take place either on a separate day followed by a rukhsati (a reception thrown by the girl's side which marks the bride's leave of the family) or during/on the day of the baraat (again, reception thrown from girl's side) after which the girl goes to live with her husband. this is followed by the walima, which, as you know, is the reception thrown by the guy's side. in all of this, only the nikah and walima are islamic, the rest are cultural.

kaka_in_usa · Apr 7th, 2005, 11:28 AM

I didnt know they have barats in pakistan too.Just out of curiosity, are they same as hindu barats?

larki · Apr 7th, 2005, 11:52 AM

what are hindu baraats like? i thought "baraat" was just a term for the reception thrown by the girl's side and i thought it could be used interchangeably with rukhsati because they both meant the same thing...it's just a formal dinner that the girl's side hosts.

Majestic · Apr 7th, 2005, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anwaar Qureshi

Majestic in simple terms, baraat is a word when groom goes to bride's place for Aqd or Nikkah

and I dunno what is a word for VALIMA in Arabic or if it is itself an Arabic word. But Valima is a sunnah for what I know.
clear?

Its Walima and it is Arabic orgin

Bookworm · Apr 12th, 2005, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sara516

valima is sunnah? i thot it was farz...

The way peopl wait for It, became like Fraz. the grooms family does not wory about Nikah which is Farz but for Valima. Which should only be done according to his capacity.

Golden_Scorpion "Tehnicaly Barat and Walima cannot be Done on same day...

Who ever Do it, then its Baraat + Dawat... not Walima. "

Technically Valima is after Nikah. It is possible that at the time of Barat they had Nikah before serving food, and they have invited common friends for both parties. The concept of Dawat after Barat is when barat goes to brides place and it is far, so the groom comes back to his place and then invite people for Valima.

Golden Scorpion · Apr 13th, 2005, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bookworm

Golden_Scorpion "Tehnicaly Barat and Walima cannot be Done on same day...

Who ever Do it, then its Baraat + Dawat... not Walima. "

Technically Valima is after Nikah. It is possible that at the time of Barat they had Nikah before serving food, and they have invited common friends for both parties. The concept of Dawat after Barat is when barat goes to brides place and it is far, so the groom comes back to his place and then invite people for Valima.

Dear BookWorm... Culture wise, who ever say or paractice anything, I am not talking about it.... where ppl call it what...
What I said.... is... What Shariaah Say abt Walima...

According to Sunnah..... Walima is the Annoncement of the COMPLETIION of marriage.

And if the marriage has not yet been consumated, its not Yet complete technicaly.

If any one call a DAWAT.... a WALIMA coz they want to call it Walima.. they are most welcome to call it anything ...

Bookworm · Apr 13th, 2005, 03:35 AM

GS, Nikah is the completion of merriage. which gives one a right to bring his bride home or can divorce. The others are just different condition and Valima is an annoucement of Nikah.

What if a person had a Nikah and will bring bride after 2 years, will he give Valima after 2 year. No No No. The whole purpose of Valima is to Annouce publically that X is now married to Y. Not that he Consumated.

Now that leave the question then why There is Dawat from Bride side after Nikah and Valima is next day or couple of days later. I would say that because in most of the cases groom and his family travel for Nikah to other then their area of residance and that is why considering them guest brides family after nikah arrange for Dawat which is also an announcement that she is married to such n such person. So after bring the bride now Groom has to arrange for Valima as an announcement that he married to such n such person.

If they are getting married in same area or in front of common friends then You do not need to announce twice. Specially I never read any thing like that in early history of Islam. What is mentioned is Valima right after Nikah. Not that Valima will be at the time when you bring the bride and consumated.