Originally Posted by Raj_ind

U might have met many Indian hindus, but U must not have lived with them as family members and friendly neibhours. I can boast of that. I have passed 25 years of my life in a muslim dominated city and locality.

If U are hinting at very few incidents of riots which occured when Pakistan victory was celebrated by muslims, than Plz count how many times Pakistan has won against India and how many times riots did break out. U will find ur conclusion. Each victory of Pakistan is widely celebrated by a particular section of muslims in most part of India. We have been living with it.




Well how muslims in India are different than Pakistani muslims? Dont they offer namaz? dont they hold long processions on moharram and holy prophet's birthday? are they anything less fanatic in terms of religion? So how diversity among Indian muslims can stop me from knowing them? Plz add to my knowledge that how Indian muslims are different than their pakistani counterpart.




I might not know about Islam VERY WELL, still I assure U that I know it quiet well and Alhamdullillah I m studying it and trying to learn it more and more. And ur statement that Islam and democracy are compitable proves that U too dont know Islam VERY WELL. It was not some extremist in India who claimed that democracy is equivalant to major SHIRK, rather it was famous Pakistani Islamic scholar Israr sahib. U can confirm it urself.

Plz dont claim again that I donk know anything about Islam. If U have any doubt, than debate is always a mannered way out.



I m not going to contest ur claim, but I had thrown a rather harsh allegation at Pakistan and Pakistanis that they decieved the very cause for which Pakistan was formed. U are yet to dismiss it or accept it. Will U now?




Well as I said procecution has already been done in some cases, in some cases it were victims themselves who took money from accused and became hostile, (U can ask for references if u wish), and investigation is still on in some cases. Lets hope that guilty are brought to book and are punished accordingly.

I appreciate ur admission regarding stains on khilafat. and discussion isnt about khilafat or Islam either, but all I wanted to say was when muslims can kill muslims under the best system of khilafat and Islam, than anything can happen in fake systems like democracy. But see how inspite of ppls of two opposite faith living together and enjoying full religious independence ( as seen rare in the world), India is rather peaceful than even Ur country. U have used heavy ammuniation against muslims in mosques, U have dropped bombs in madarsas, and what not. (pl ask for reference if U wish).



Well what U are saying? havent U have imposition of curfew in ur cities due to riots? What is difference between a Pakistani riot and and Indian riot? hasnt innocent muslims died in riots in ur country? are U kidding with me and the forum? what is ur appropriate scale which U are claiming?

Its criminals and terrorists in India even who commit such crime of rioting. general populace in India live in more peace than anywhere in the world or its neibhourhood. And had general population been commiting riots in India than there would have been no muslim living here. Hindu here outnumber muslims by 7 to 1.



Not only In India, Muslims over the world are relatively poor as compared to hindus, provided u take into account wealth produced through skills and industry and not by natural resources or property. Same is in case of education. Hindus are way ahead universally by muslims in this field too.

LOWER REPRESENTATION in private and public sector job is because of less awareness of education among muslims. But things are changing fast Alhamdullillah. Avaiablity of bank credit is related with repayment of loans. Unfortunately muslims have been not so good in repayment in the past, so banks take a cautious stand while distrituting loans. Hindus too have loan crunch if their repayment history is not up to mark. Its pure business brother. Regarding living in slums, it is related by wealth. There are wealthy muslims who live in palaces throughout India. And hindus too live in sllums if they cant afford a better accomodation for themselves. Infrastructure is not selectively
bad for any community. Pl be realistic and face hard truth.

Peace.

Originally Posted by Med911

Yeah, but we're Pakistan, where such things exist. Point was to discuss India, self professed best place on the planet, where everyone pee's in golden toilets and its rains chocolate!

Originally Posted by afishcurry

Noboyd ever claims that but one thign is sure we are yet
to carpet bomb any civilian population in Idnia unlike the last baluchsitan operation of pakistan army where Bugti was killed..

We do have problme and we deal with it democratically..

Originally Posted by Med911

Then ou know all about Muslims im sure. And I guess that means you know EVERYTHING about Muslims!
And im glad the Muslims of India know how to pick the winning side!
But as far as I know, no one has been killed in Pakistan over cricket.. Leave that to Indians...
Pakistani attitudes are dfferent, there language is different, their way of thinking is different. Just because you share a religion doesnt mean you are exactly alike.
Pakistan and India are two dfferent countries, people may ray the same way but their ennvironment and culture are very different.
I dont need to explain to you how peole are different, common sense tells us that...

All I can tell you is that in Pakistan we have the largest religious partes in the country, parties based on deobandi philosophy who support and participate in elections. They aparently dont have a problem with Democracy, and so I dont know why you do...
A simple google of islam and democracy is enough...

I dont think you know what Pakistan was based on. Pakistanis are still confronting tis issue. If your contention is that Pakistan, in being a Democracy is somehow going agianst the spirit on which it was founded, then once again, you dont what your talking about.

The isuue isnt regarding muslims in foreign countries, but in India.
If we were to compare Muslims nations to India...

India total literacy rate: 61 %
Turkey: 87.4 %
iNDONESIA: 90.4%

Just a small examples of Muslims counries outshining India. Other indicators are also far better then India's. You can check countries like Egypt and Iran and compare social indicators with India...

Fact is that there are a number of Muslims Countries that have done better then India.
I suggest you open CIA fact book on google, and search India and then compare it with other Muslim countries... You wil see how succesful your Hindus of India are in comparison.

Originally Posted by Slickstar

in India its ochlocracy.

Originally Posted by Raj_ind

I dont claim to know everything about muslims, but most of the things.

So far as I know, no one has been killed in India even over cricket, like in Pakistan.



Well let them have no problem with democracy, let them support and participate in democracy,but that doesnt mean that Islam and democracy are compitable. BTW it seems that U dont agree with Dr. Israr Sahib too who has claimed that democracy is shirk. Now if so called deobandi parties dont have any issue with shirk than its their problem.

Pl dont ask me to google Islam and democracy, rather plz bring any reference from Holy Quran and Sunnah to prove ur point.

I too dont have problem with democracy brother, but apparently Islam has, and I m just spelling that out.



Well so far as I know, Pakistan is the only country in the world formed in the name of Islam. So naturally it was based on Holy Quran and Sunnah of the holy Prophet. However it took the opposite route and compteted with kuffar nation in almost everything accept eating the forbidden meat(Thankfully). Plz let me know if I m wrong? If yes than why? Was'nt Pakistan formed in the name of Islam?



Issue was nothing. If Muslims in India dont want to educate themselves than who can force education on them? Govt policies and schools are open to all, irrespective of any religious bias.

Peace.

Originally Posted by afishcurry

Noboyd ever claims that but one thign is sure we are yet
to carpet bomb any civilian population in Idnia unlike the last baluchsitan operation of pakistan army where Bugti was killed..

We do have problme and we deal with it democratically..

Originally Posted by Med911

Like you resolved Khalistan and Kashmir democratically,,,

Originally Posted by Med911

Like you resolved Khalistan and Kashmir democratically,,,