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    Results 1 to 15 of 15
    1. #1
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      Please tell me the meaning of arabic noun yazeed

      Apparently, this name was redundant in a brief period of time. Obviously people stopped using this name for reason known to everyone. But before that people used to name their child because of some good meaning. What is its actual meaning

      My question to Shia and Sunni folks.

      What is your view about Hazrat Abdullah bin Zubair (ra) ? How shia books see the man and his standing. What is Sunni perspective on his stand. thanks
      Bazinggaaaa ....

    2. #2
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      Quote Originally Posted by Code_Red View Post
      What is your view about Hazrat Abdullah bin Zubair (ra) ? How shia books see the man and his standing. What is Sunni perspective on his stand. thanks
      present day imami shias dont have a good view of him primarily because of his opposition to Ali at the time of Jamal and to Mukhtar thaqavi later when he is caliph
      The supporters of Ali in that time however did not have such a negative view of him as he offered to them atleast the better alternative to ummayyyad hegemony and several of them have sided with him even against Muktar ( most well known is Ibrahim b Malik son of Al-Ashtar Nakhai).Sukayna daughter of Hussain b Ali was married to Musab, brother of abdullah b zubair.
      present day sunnis obviously hold him in high regard because of his being a sahabi and also because of leading the hijazi revival against the ummayyads.His caliphate is avoided by "good" sunnis as it involves a lot of intra-sahaba warfare a dicey subject amongst them.His stance is widely debated, opinion is split whether he was the rebel or the revolutionary.His stance is seen more or less in the same light as Hussain's , Ansar's at Harra and that of Ibn Ashath's kufans a generation later.
      Last edited by Das Reich; Jan 19th, 2011 at 09:23 AM.

    3. #3
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      abdullah ibn zubair ra obviously did not follow the critereon of the shia 12ers, so his religious status from their pov is like any other sunni including abu bakr ra, umar ra, and uthman ra

      shi' narrations only have 3 people as muslims, at the time of the passing of prophet saw!
      Last edited by shardmanny; Jan 19th, 2011 at 10:25 AM.

    4. #4
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      abdullah ibn zubair ra obviously did not follow the critereon of the shia 12ers, so his religious status from their pov is like any other sunni including abu bakr ra, umar ra, and uthman ra
      right anyone who doesent believe in imamate as they do is suspect , including several wellknown supporters of ali
      in some shi' narrations salman alfarsi ra doesnt even make it onto the list of muslims (total number is 3 muslims according to these narrations). he lost an ear in the riddah wars fighting under the leadership of abu bakr ra, so when this matter came to kalayni three/four hundred years later, what was he to do?
      bro i think u mean ammar b yasir, he lost his ear in yamana
      and several wellknown supporters of sayyidna ali participated in riddah and futuhat under Sayyidna abu bakr and sayyidna umar.kulyani and baqir majlisi definately have a extreme anti-sahaba view mainly to promote their imams as super-humans

      however lets stick to the topic at hand

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      ^yes, you are right, i was refering to amar bin yasir ra.

      code red: the name yazeed is still used

    6. #6
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      Quote Originally Posted by Code_Red View Post
      Please tell me the meaning of arabic noun yazeed

      Apparently, this name was redundant in a brief period of time. Obviously people stopped using this name for reason known to everyone. But before that people used to name their child because of some good meaning. What is its actual meaning

      My question to Shia and Sunni folks.

      What is your view about Hazrat Abdullah bin Zubair (ra) ? How shia books see the man and his standing. What is Sunni perspective on his stand. thanks
      I think that Yazeed in literal sense means to exceed or excel..........

      Abdullah's father Zubayr was one of the leaders of the rebel army but at night he was called by Imam Ali AS who reminded him of a saying of the Prophet SAWW warning Zubair of the day when he will be opposing the ALI AS...........Zubayr immediately showed remorse and turned his back on his army........his son Abdullah when seeing his father withdraw, criticized him and told him tht he was fearful of Ali AS.......Zubayr said to Abdullah "Woe be on you, I have sworn that I would not fight him.” (Tarikh Tabari, 4/509)
      Last edited by Nussairee; Jan 19th, 2011 at 03:57 PM.
      If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.

    7. #7
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      Thankyou folks for brief answers.

      What I understand from Shia theology that they expand the idea of evil and good leadership, by explaining the events before and after Karbala.

      Hussain (ra) did not accept a leadership and fought against a tyrant

      After that

      Ibn Zubair(ra) did not accept a leadership fought against same tyrant

      How come the former get all the due credit and later is ignored or not given any credit for his (and his followers) fight against same evil ?

      On the same note I am fully aware of importance shia Scholars give to linage and past adherence but here comes a glitch in that theory too.

      Shia community highly respect and give credit to Hur for his timely and wise decision of detachment from evil and joining Hussain (ra)'s side.

      Now Hur Gets all the credit and praise for his fight against evil but Ibn-e-Zubair gets none despite his fight against same evil and ultimately Martyrdom later on after battle of Harra ?

      No one discussed Hur's past in Karbala tales

      Ye Kahaan ka insaaf hai ??

    8. #8
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      It would have been better if you guys had stayed on topic and did not find it an yet another apportunity to pass comments on your opponents but since it has been done, hence this post.


      Quote Originally Posted by Das Reich View Post
      right anyone who doesent believe in imamate as they do is suspect , including several wellknown supporters of ali
      Of course, or do you want us to respect people on the basis of 'popularity' and 'well knownness' ! If you think from Shia prespective, then isnt it the right logic? Or would you respect and deem an individual pious who was on a faith other than the one that is considered right by you?

      and several wellknown supporters of sayyidna ali participated in riddah and futuhat under Sayyidna abu bakr and sayyidna umar.kulyani and baqir majlisi definately have a extreme anti-sahaba view mainly to promote their imams as super-humans
      Perhaps Bukhari and Muslim have even more extreme views who at times went to derogate prophet in their attempt to excel a few sahaba!
      Anyohw, I have been following your posts since few years now and i see that the main reason of such posts by you is flawed understanding of 'supporters' or 'Shias' (at that time). Acording to you, anyone who 'supports' Ahlylbayt should be respected no matter what such an individual did later on. As per such a flawed logic, Khawarij should have been the most pious and respected segment.

      however lets stick to the topic at hand
      better.
      Prophet:
      "I am FOREVER leaving amongst you TWO SUCCESSORS, they are the Book of Allah and my nearest kindred, my Ahl al-Bayt. BOTH will NEVER separate from each other ."

    9. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by Code_Red View Post
      Thankyou folks for brief answers.

      What I understand from Shia theology that they expand the idea of evil and good leadership, by explaining the events before and after Karbala.

      Hussain (ra) did not accept a leadership and fought against a tyrant

      After that

      Ibn Zubair(ra) did not accept a leadership fought against same tyrant

      How come the former get all the due credit and later is ignored or not given any credit for his (and his followers) fight against same evil ?
      There is mark different between the two. The former was a 'sacrifice' and that too not a general one but a special one and thats is why we see that Allah had been time and again sending angels to Prophet (s) to predict the tragedy of Karbala which was not the case with any other individual. And remember, Imam Hussain not only laid down his own life but of his family member and of his Sahaba. He was Imam of the time, so what he did was his religious duty according to the given circumstances and wisdom which is best known by Allah. Hence, it is not irrelevant tosee that entire nature had advanced its grief over the tragedy.

      So you cannot compare the rejection of Yazeed by Imam Hussain with that of by any other individual.

      On the same note I am fully aware of importance shia Scholars give to linage and past adherence but here comes a glitch in that theory too.
      If you are referring to the linage of Imam Hussain then I assume you do not have any doubts over that?

      Shia community highly respect and give credit to Hur for his timely and wise decision of detachment from evil and joining Hussain (ra)'s side.

      Now Hur Gets all the credit and praise for his fight against evil but Ibn-e-Zubair gets none despite his fight against same evil and ultimately Martyrdom later on after battle of Harra ?

      The reason Hur (as) is given credit for his timely and wise decision of detachment from evil is not only because of that rather the main purpose is that he came in aid of Ahlulbayt and adhered to them, that is the key you are missing.


      No one discussed Hur's past in Karbala tales

      Ye Kahaan ka insaaf hai ??
      Bilkul yehi insaaf hai which tells us that one who adhered to Ahlulbayt is to be respected even if he comes within the pale at the eleventh hour and hence his history will not matter at all where as an individual doing all sorts of Ibadat and doing the most righteous acts BUT not adhering to Ahullbayt is of no use!
      Prophet:
      "I am FOREVER leaving amongst you TWO SUCCESSORS, they are the Book of Allah and my nearest kindred, my Ahl al-Bayt. BOTH will NEVER separate from each other ."

    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by Code_Red View Post
      Thankyou folks for brief answers.

      What I understand from Shia theology that they expand the idea of evil and good leadership, by explaining the events before and after Karbala.

      Hussain (ra) did not accept a leadership and fought against a tyrant

      After that

      Ibn Zubair(ra) did not accept a leadership fought against same tyrant

      How come the former get all the due credit and later is ignored or not given any credit for his (and his followers) fight against same evil ?

      On the same note I am fully aware of importance shia Scholars give to linage and past adherence but here comes a glitch in that theory too.

      Shia community highly respect and give credit to Hur for his timely and wise decision of detachment from evil and joining Hussain (ra)'s side.

      Now Hur Gets all the credit and praise for his fight against evil but Ibn-e-Zubair gets none despite his fight against same evil and ultimately Martyrdom later on after battle of Harra ?

      No one discussed Hur's past in Karbala tales

      Ye Kahaan ka insaaf hai ??
      they have narrations which are fabricated and cannot be authenticated because they have no point of reference to authenticate with except a theory

      we have accepted the quran as that point but they do not, as it doesnt tell us, the sunnis, about ali ra. so they base religion on heresy (heretics) and make up things like the real quran will come with a jewish mahdi.

      so morallaty is lost, because they say they believe in muhammad saw but in essence they reject the quran unless their own will is given preference over the quran

      the real shiaism is not about succession, its about ali being first and the last things alike. for example prophet saw was created then ali was. ali then taught the creation including the angels their religion!

      in other narrations ali ra let off a son of shaytaan because he promised to tempt sunnis and make them all children of zina.!!


      succession and karbala are minor details on which the shia rely on the sunni belief of elevated rank of ahulbayt ra


      these guys who come on here just come to defend shiasm and rafidism, they have no interest in the truth or neither do they ever apreciate the wisdom of the quran
      Last edited by shardmanny; Jan 20th, 2011 at 09:18 AM.

    11. #11
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      lol, dont you ever get tired of all this absurdities and stupidities? How many times you have been made to correct yourself regarding all above stupidites you have attributed to Shias but since the nijasat of nasibism is flowing into your veins, hence it seems that you are not ready to come to light. I wont waste my time in refuting the junk this time again, but a free advice, its time for you to change the room of the mullah you have been living with.
      Prophet:
      "I am FOREVER leaving amongst you TWO SUCCESSORS, they are the Book of Allah and my nearest kindred, my Ahl al-Bayt. BOTH will NEVER separate from each other ."

    12. #12
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      I got an email from the local mosque management according to which Brother Yazeed (yazeed bhai ) will present next years budget in this meeting.
      Low kar lo gull.
      Fools never disagree.

    13. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by Code_Red View Post
      Thankyou folks for brief answers.

      What I understand from Shia theology that they expand the idea of evil and good leadership, by explaining the events before and after Karbala.
      Shia theology is that right to choose a leader belongs to Allah SWT alone.......Prophet SAWW chose Ali AS by the command of Allah SWT as a leader of the nation after him.......and that is why the best of sahabas stayed loyal to ALI AS thru out the ordeals he faced.....

      Hussain (ra) did not accept a leadership and fought against a tyrant
      Similar to how his brother Al Hasan AS did not accept a tyrant of his time......and his father and grand father and his great grand father against Abraha........all were forces of good that stood against the tyrants of their times.......

      Ibn Zubair(ra) did not accept a leadership fought against same tyrant

      How come the former get all the due credit and later is ignored or not given any credit for his (and his followers) fight against same evil ?
      From theological perspective Zubair is not Hussain (as). Hussain (as) is praised by Allah SWT and his Prophet SAWW.......his love is demanded by ALLAH SWT as the wage of risalat in Quran........he is Ahlay Kissa and Ahlay Mubahila.........he is leader of the youth in paradise......Prophet SAWW deemed loving Hussain AS as loving himself and hurting him as hurting Prophet SAWW and Allah SWT according tothe unanimously accepted hadiths..........Hussain's life and each act is for Islam...........can same be said about Ibn Zubair? what is his character like? study his character in detail and judge for urself........

      On the same note I am fully aware of importance shia Scholars give to linage and past adherence but here comes a glitch in that theory too.
      have u studied Quran?........ALL the representatives of Allah SWT are chosen from a certain lineague.........every Prophet that Quran mentions is succeeded by a Prophet from his own family........Is it a conincidence that Prophet SAWW highlighted the importance of his progeny at every possible chance from the start of the mission till the end to an extent that our prayers are incomplete without sending our salutations upon them...........Prophet SAWW at the end of his mission said that he is leaving behind Quran and his Progeny.......and till the time we seek guidance and attachement to them, we will be guided aright............

      Shia community highly respect and give credit to Hur for his timely and wise decision of detachment from evil and joining Hussain (ra)'s side.
      Shia also love Muawiya Ibn Yazid RA because he refused to sit on a pulpit which he said was colored with blood of the family of Prophet SAWW........

      Now Hur Gets all the credit and praise for his fight against evil but Ibn-e-Zubair gets none despite his fight against same evil and ultimately Martyrdom later on after battle of Harra ?
      Ibn Zubair did not died during the battle of Hurra but was killed later while fighting for power against Abdul Malik bin Marwan.........I think he was killed by Hajjaj......

      No one discussed Hur's past in Karbala tales
      there is information on Hurr's past but what is important are the words that Imam Hussain AS told Hurr himself.........the leader of the Youth of Paradise told hurr that "Hurr, your moter named you right for u r FREE (Hurr) now in this world and you will be FREE (Hurr) in akhira".........so nobody's fate is guaranteed including some of the giant sahabas but Hurr certainly seem to have secured a good place for himself...........

      Ye Kahaan ka insaaf hai ??
      Yahi FAQAT insaaf hay.........it is good tht u r thinking abt this stuff!.........
      Last edited by Nussairee; Jan 20th, 2011 at 04:58 PM.
      If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.

    14. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by shardmanny View Post
      they have narrations which are fabricated and cannot be authenticated because they have no point of reference to authenticate with except a theory

      we have accepted the quran as that point but they do not, as it doesnt tell us, the sunnis, about ali ra. so they base religion on heresy (heretics) and make up things like the real quran will come with a jewish mahdi.

      so morallaty is lost, because they say they believe in muhammad saw but in essence they reject the quran unless their own will is given preference over the quran

      the real shiaism is not about succession, its about ali being first and the last things alike. for example prophet saw was created then ali was. ali then taught the creation including the angels their religion!

      in other narrations ali ra let off a son of shaytaan because he promised to tempt sunnis and make them all children of zina.!!


      succession and karbala are minor details on which the shia rely on the sunni belief of elevated rank of ahulbayt ra


      these guys who come on here just come to defend shiasm and rafidism, they have no interest in the truth or neither do they ever apreciate the wisdom of the quran
      seems like u dont even have an ounce of nobility or shame in u........u talk abt Quran.....I challenge u to open a
      thread where we discuss our beliefs and ur beliefs purely from Quran......no Hadith of Tafseer allowd just simple, common logic............let me know when u decide to do that.........
      Last edited by Nussairee; Jan 20th, 2011 at 04:05 PM.
      If your religion is worth killing for, please start with yourself.

    15. #15
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      Never explain urself to any1 The person who likes u doesn't need it &The person who dislike u won't believe it