X2

I get confused, because I believe that Islam is a reasonable sensible religion, and things that are prohibited are prohibited for some reason. I dont understand the workarounds though, someone explain me this stuff

so riddle me this batman...

1) sleeping around is bad, it has societal, social, moral implications but then i see guys in beards throw around words like misyar and mutaah. what is that all about and why does it make any sense.

2) some say interest is usury, fine. but then the same people look at 'shariah compliant financing" , explain to me how shriah based financing in essence is any different than a fixed interest mortgage?

3) if you are not a blood relative you are na mehram and you observe hijab..so how does a simple act of nursing a child make him a 'mehram' its not that his genes changed, its not that he became a blood relative.

4) I have read by some that muslims should not dress like nonmuslims and that my jeans and jacket are bad, usually the type of people saying that are wearing the clothes traditional to their geographical area and either were clothes that they and non muslism both wore..and wear like iom middle east, or pakistan and india..

JimmyKimble

I think the instruction is "where any thing from halal dress ther shouldn't be showing off+ or israf(wasting money)"

As you said every thing is there for a reason.
Sleeping around is bad for social reasons, Matah take care of those social reasons.

TLK

1) sleeping around is bad, it has societal, social, moral implications but then i see guys in beards throw around words like misyar and mutaah. what is that all about and why does it make any sense.

I guess that is why Mutaah is not acceptable in some school of thoughts.

2) some say interest is usury, fine. but then the same people look at 'shariah compliant financing" , explain to me how shriah based financing in essence is any different than a fixed interest mortgage?

Any and every Islamic bank is backed up by a bank (maybe federal) that gives out loan on interest, so no matter how you look at it, the foundation of that financing is interest based. In my humble opinion, people should look beyond this faltooness of shariah compliant financing" (I wanted to use another word than faltooness but I know that people would mind)

3) if you are not a blood relative you are na mehram and you observe hijab..so how does a simple act of nursing a child make him a 'mehram' its not that his genes changed, its not that he became a blood relative.

Meharm just means that they are disqualified for Nikah forever. It has nothing to do with being a blood relative.

4) I am have read by some that muslims should not dress like nonmuslims and that my jeans and jacket are bad, usually the type of people saying that are wearing the clothes traditional to their geographical area and either were clothes that they and non muslism both wore..and wear like iom middle east, or pakistan and india.

This is another faltooness. Prophet used to wear the same clothes that Abu Jehal (kafir) used to wear. Clothes conditions are it should not be bodily hugging enough to highlight body contours. One hadith is, you should avoid looking like kuffars and people get confused with dressing up like them

psyah

Peace X2

1) Context specific at the best ... hypocrisy at the worst
2) Made up nonesense designed to get Muslims to take out loans
3) The person is made up of three centres, physical, emotional and spiritual the answer does not lie in genetics (physical) domain. If there is imbalance then of course forget milk relatives even blood relatives are not sacrosanct and you can get pure incest in cases where the sacred balances are tipped.
4) If someone can take a look at you and call you a Muslim and you have covered the aura and that you resemble your own gender in the region you live ... then you know you are on a winner. Ignore everyone else.

JimmyKimble

I am not shia, but I believe mattah take care of those issues.
Plus man get to be a man and take care of the woman and the baby who is born as a result.

SindSagar

JimmyKimble

lolz

X2

its not a question of missing..
missing out..maybe

X2

psyah I get the aura and resemble gender in the region etc...
but seriously, speaking strictly of clothing, how can one look at a dude wearing a suit and say he is muslim.

ume-zafeerah

I get confused, because I believe that Islam is a reasonable sensible religion, and things that are prohibited are prohibited for some reason. I dont understand the workarounds though, someone explain me this stuff

X2 mein bhi yehi sochti hoon ke Islam eik jamaa and mukamal mazahab hai sensible logo ke liye jo isey samjhna chahe to and us per belief kerna chahey to

so riddle me this batman...

1) sleeping around is bad, it has societal, social, moral implications but then i see guys in beards throw around words like misyar and mutaah. what is that all about and why does it make any sense.
Muttah and Misyar ke baarey mein mera itna extensive knowledge nahi to mein us detail mein jana nahi pasand karoon gi jab tak ke mujhe sahi ilm naa ho.
2) some say interest is usury, fine. but then the same people look at 'shariah compliant financing" , explain to me how shriah based financing in essence is any different than a fixed interest mortgage?

Kuffar-e-makkah bhi yehi samjhtay they ke ham sirf munaffa hi to ley rahey hain to phir is mein buraii kaya hai and woh yeh nahi samjhtay they ke soud and munaffay mein bohat faraq hai
Jahaan tak Islamic banking kaa taaluq hai its not my concern ke woh kisi aur se soud letay hain to baat waheen aa jaati hai No its not no matter how you look at it.In my humble opinion jo log yeh mashwara detay hain ke hamein "phaltoo SHariah financing" ko chor dena chahiye woh is baat per kyoon nahi aatey ke ham aisa kaun saa system banayein jis se hamein and baqi muslims ko faida ho. doosron ke banayey hoay system mein keeray nikalna bohat asaan hai system ko soch ker samjh ker banana ke soud bhi naa ho and muslim ko faida bhi ho bohat mushkil .mujh se kisi ne sawaal kiya thaa ke agar house ko munaffa hota hai to Islamci Shriah "phaltoo" financing waley kaya kartay hain and agar nuqsaan hota hai to Islamic Shariah "phaltoo" financing waley kaya kertay hain ofcoure us shakhs kaa saawaal sahi hai mujhe bhi yehi concern thaa bohat ziada ke then I asked them and they said agar aap ko faida ho gaa to aap ko apna profil miley gaa and agar aap ko nuqsaan ho gaa to us ki responsibility hamari hai ham aap ke saath nuqsaan mein shamil hon gay.Look agar koii Phaltoo shariah financing kaa muslim mujhe document per yeh baat state ker ke dey day to mein us ki baat maan loon gi kyoon ke woh eik muslim hai mein aur ziada tahqeeq mein nahi jaoon gi.Hamein muslims kaa kaabhi kabhi itebaar bhii kerna chahiye.

3)you are na mehram and you observe hijab..so how does a simple act of nursing a child make him a 'mehram' its not that his genes changed, its not that he became a blood relative.

yeh sab se behter jawaab hai but I think aap bohat bara sawaal ker rahey ho because Prophet Mohammad(p.b.u.h.) ne Hazrat Haleema (R.A.) kaa doodh bhi piya tha and aap yeh pooch rahey ho ke jo hamaray Nabhi ne kiya woh ghalat thaa WOW
4) I am have read by some that muslims should not dress like nonmuslims and that my jeans and jacket are bad, usually the type of people saying that are wearing the clothes traditional to their geographical area and either were clothes that they and non muslism both wore..and wear like iom middle east, or pakistan and india

yeh eik phaaltoo issue aap ne utthaya hai because aap bohat achi tarah jaantay ho ke dress kaa sirf modest hona zaroori hai paint shirt waghairaa kaa is se koii taaluq nahi

Ab meray pass aap ke liye khuch sawaalat hain aap please jawaab dena pasand kerein gay to mein poochon

psyah

Cos of his beard !!!

desert bird

^^ I have seen clean shaved with suits more devoted and true muslims than those terrorists most of those which have beard on thier faces who blow up people daily here or anywhere else in the world.

Not to object Sunnat-e-Rasool(pbuh) in any case but sunnat is something different with wajib/farz plus Libaas depends more upon cultural values/traditions than Islam. Islam is not about wearing shalwar/long arab abaya/trousers , its more than that !

X2

funny I did not know only muslims can have facial hair.

X2

okay, that acceptablle


I am not sure why you did not follow your stance that since you dont know about a subject you will not talk about it.

look you are the one who proposed 'shraiah compliant financing" ... on one hand you bring about kuffar who said sirf munaffa lay rahay hain.....please do read what islamic financing is.

so I dont believe that modern day interest is the same as loansharking and usury of that era..fine i may be wrong.

but how can you on one hand point to kuffar and say hey they tried to justify interest by calling it profit. please analyze 'shariah compliant financing" and tell me how they work.

so if you dont believe in interest then dont go for it no matter what name is it under.




really? sorry that is not the case.

why are you getting so agitated, do you guys have a shriah compioant financing business or something? baat saheeh tarah bhi ki ja sakti hai.


Look agar koii Phaltoo shariah financing kaa muslim mujhe document per yeh baat state ker ke dey day to mein us ki baat maan loon gi kyoon ke woh eik muslim hai mein aur ziada tahqeeq mein nahi jaoon gi.Hamein muslims kaa kaabhi kabhi itebaar bhii kerna chahiye.


its a bohot baraa sawal, and there is a better answer than saying oh the prophet did it and wow. it was not an islamic tradition, it ws an arab tradition..it was not just the prophet who was nursed by someone, many others were the, and actually ages ago.

maybe you should have said the same thing as you said fro teh first question, that you dont know the answer.



I am glad to see you see this one as a falty issue, just like i see many other things as faltu issues, however, there are plenty of people who to this day say that you can not dress like non muslims..which of course makes no sense..

as long as you can digest the answers please ask, but how about a different thread.

dewdrops2

Khair for asking , even i am confused about it & have not received any proper answers yet.

hareem01

Yeh to Shaykh Akram Awan ki sunnat ki shaan main gustakhi ho rahi hai.

desert bird

If you have seen YouTube his younger son with beard while older has not . His son replied there is no compulsion from my father(maulana akram awan)to have beard as the basic rule of quran and sunnah, There is no Jabr in Islam.

There is beard in islam not islam in beard (Maulana Maudoodi rehamatullah alaih)

Captain1

Misyar is something recently made up, mut'ah is not allowed in Sunni fiqh. So those who are "Arab" followers and not necessarily "Islam" followers might be okay with "Misyar".
Most of the products who claim to be "shariah" compliant are not really compliant, I can atleast say about Lariba (that they are not!). There is a criteria which distinguishes them.

The milk gets mixed up in the blood and the child becomes "kinda" blood related
Yeah yeah *jamahi leyin* Did they really read the hadith? Context? Its meaning?

X2

captain, that is why i chose my words carefully and said some muslims, not islam or muslims.

Q#3 is the only one that is diff and that is more meant for people to think that just because someone is not a blood relative does not mean there cant be a relationship based on respect, otherwise what is some milk eh?

ume-zafeerah

jin logo ne yeh faisla ker liya hia ke haraam haraam nahi hai balkay halaal hai to baat hi khatam ho jaati hai un ke saamney kisi bhi kisam kaa Islamic system rakh diya jaaye woh us ko mannay waley nahi hain kyoon ke us mein un kaa nuqsaan hai .Payaray Nabi ke zamanay mein bhi kuffar is baat ko nahi mantay they kyoon ke us mein un kaa nuqsaan hota thaa.Yeh soud kaa nizaam aaj ka nahi hai balkay Hazoor (p.b.u.h.) ke zamanay mein bhi yeh exist kerta thaa aur aaj ke modren log yeh samjhtay hain ke yeh modren economy ke paida kiye hoay challenges hain.
Ghazwaae Badr se pehlay Abu Sufyaan kaa jo kafla samaan ley ker aa raha thaa us mein pooray kuffar-e-makka kaa paisa invest hoa thaa aur yeh sari investment unhon ne credit aur sood per liye hoaa thaa jo aajkal ke zamanay mein bhi hoti hai.
naa mein islamic financing ke liye kaam kerti hoon naa hi mein ne un se loan liya hai lekin mera kayaal hai ke agar aap soud se bachan chahtey hain to Islamic financing hi America mein wahid option hai .
Mein ne Islamic financing to bohat detail mein parha hai agar aap ko Islamic financing ki basics samjhni hain to "mufti Taqi Usmani" ki books parhein.Meray kayaal mein aap ko Islamic finances ke basics and concepts nahi pata hain pehlay samjh ker aayein meray pass itna phaltoo time nahi ke un logo ke saath mein apna time zaya karoon jo haraam ko haraam nahi samjhtay.
Hazrat Mohammad (p.b.u.h.) ke zamanay mein jo ARAB TRADITIONS sahi theen un ko Hazrat Mohammad (p.b.u.h.) ney rehnay diya aur jo ghalat theen un se mana ker diya kyoon ke ARABS hi mein bohat puranay zamanay se Anmbia chalay aa rahey hian aur un mein anmbia ki rawayaat maujood theen jo AHLE AHNAAF follow kertay they.Aur Hazrat Mohammad ke anay ke waqt sab mushriq nahi they eik tabqa ahley Ahnaaf thaa aur yeh rawayaat un se aa rahi hian.Aur agar yeh rawayat ghalat hoti to Hazarat Mohammad (p.b.u.h.) ko kabhi Hazrat haleema doodh naa pilaaten kyoon ke nabi paida hotay saath nabi hota aur woh koii aisa kaam nahi kerta jo ke baad mein shariah mein haraam ho jaaye.

[/quote]meray paas aap ke liye bohat saarey sawaalaat hain pehlay aap in ke jawaabaat dein.

AQ

1. Mutah is only allowed in one school of thought; Misyar is not allowed in some schools of thought, atleast the one I know of. Never heard of it being practiced. Perhaps, people who practice/believe in these can better answer that why it makes sense. I will keep away from this.

2. How exactly 'Sharia Compliant Financing' works? My initial understanding was that the 'middle' party actually pays off bank without interest in cash or however way, and then, sells the property to customer with profit in fixed installments... which is exactly how a legitimate business is done. What I am hearing now is that bank is involved at the back of it and interest is being paid at atleast one point... That defeats the purpose and if in fact, that is how it is run then, it is not islamic. If it is run how I had initially understood, then, there is no issue and it is perfectly Islamic.

3. We can ask and give same argument on how does a simple act of having nikah done with na-mehram makes the person mehram? it's not that genes changed, it's not that person became a blood relative...

As far as reply to the argument of Ume-zafeera goes, our faith should be that Prophet was given for nursing because in Allah's eyes, that custom was fine and Allah would have never let that happen to His beloved prophet, had that custom of nursing was not acceptable.

4. The hadeeth is researched in context by a number of scholars, and what I know it is about religious dress themselves that is, when you see people wearing such dress, you recognize that they belong to certain faith... ex: sikh's turban, Rabbai's specific dressing etc. Jeans and paints are considered bad by ignorants.

ume-zafeerah

answer to aap ko mil gaya hai ke milk kaa taaluq bhi to blood se hota hai
and jitnay relations hotay hain woh Quraan mein defined and saari aap ki inheritance blood ke opper base kerti hai.
Hazrat Zaid (R.A.) Hazoor (p.b.u.h.) ke moun bolay betay they magar woh Hazoor ki wives se parda kertay they kyoon ke un ke liye woh naa mehram they.

midnighteyes

Quote:

sleeping around is bad, it has societal, social, moral implications but then i see guys in beards throw around words like misyar and mutaah. what is that all about and why does it make any sense.

1. Guys in beards do not automatically represent Islam and/or Muslims
2. Mutah is not allowed in any Sunni school of thought, it is only practiced by Shias. Rest of Muslims all consider it totally haraam, it is not a real marriage it is only zinna
3. Misyar is allowed as long as it fulfills all the requirements of Islamic marriage (like approval of wali, witnesses, mahr, public announcement of union etc). Basically the only difference is that the wife stays in a seperate residence and the husband is not financially responsible for her. This is her right whether she wants to agree to this or not. If she says no, then husband is Islamically obliged to provide for her, care for her etc. There is nothing wrong with this. Whats wrong is when they do it in secret, or dont get approval from the wali or dont make the marriage public and are just sneaking around ----then it just becomes too much like prostitution or something!!

EcoShan

M really happy to see this thread cuz it proves that ppl still think about their faith "logically" instead of following it blindly like billions of other muslims Jazak Allah khair

Actually i like spiderman better.



Just to add, besides "societal, social, moral" sleeping around also has alot of medical disadvantages especially for women. now back to ur questionology, bhai u r smarter than me and u prolly know the answer urself aswell. If Lakir ke Fakir who follow the teachings of their "spiritual teachers" blindly start saying something, it doesn make it a part of islam. The primary source for understanding islam is Quran and Quran alone, anything besides is secondry. Quran talks about adultery at many places, just find any quran search engine and put in query for "adultery" and u will see that Allah at no place mentioned either Muttah or Misyar. Allah told watever is halal or haram. Allah talks in "detail" about marriage in Quran, then y didn Allah mention Misyar or muttah?? as it is also suppose to be a form of marriage or temp marriage?? Allah didn have enough space in Quran or got out of words??. Allah talks about NAMAZ about 67 times, talks about ZAKAT more than 30 times , and u will be surprised to know that Allah talks about marriage at 17 places in Quran and told who should u marry and how should u marry but forgot to mention Misyar and Muttah :S wow, my Lord seems to have a bad memory Naudu billah. so u know where m going right.

I'd say its the best question in the list. also being a wana be economist i love the topic. Again quran describes Islamic economic system in detail.
these are some examples
2:275
2:276
3:130
7:85
4:20
5:90
3:180
25:67
7:31
98:5
64:15
64:16

Believe me there are many ppl in the market who claim to offer u islamic financing or shariah banking but they are just playing with the words like "Mudaraba, Murabaha, Musharaka, Riba, Wakala, Qard, Mudarib, and ijara" and selling u interest based financing and by hearing all those arabic words ppl think its halal lol.
But it doesn mean that shariah financing or banking doesn exist, for sure it does. Wat is interest?? its renting ur money, just like u rent a car or a house, and u have to pay regular fixed payments which is haram in case of money, but not in case of rent a car or rent a house. there are some banks who do partnership with u, for example a house is $100,000, u pay 10,000 and the banks pay 90,000. so u own 10% of the house and the bank owns 90% of the house. and now u sign a contract that u r gona pay the bank 90,000 back within 20 or 25 years without any interest. and now u start living in the house, the issue to consider is that u own 10% and the bank owns 90% but u r living in the house alone and taking advantage of it alone, and bank cant get any benefit cuz renting money in islam is haram, so wat bank would do is to do business they would rent u the 90% of the HOUSE that they own, instead of renting MONEY, and the rent is decided by 6 nuetral real estate brokers. (now keep in mind renting house is halal and renting money is haram, they might sound same but they are 1000% different concepts.)

so the first month u make a monthly payment on the house without interest, say its 1000 dollars and u pay rent for the 90% of the house that bank owns, and just assume its $ 600, so basically u paid bank 1600. now the next month bank doesn own 90% of the house it just owns 89% cuz u made a $1000 payment last month, so this month u would still make $1000 dollars interest free payment but instead of paying $600 rent of 90% of the house u would pay $595 for only 89% of the house and it would be $1595 this month, and next month 1590, and then 1585. so basically ur monthly payments keep on decreasing every month instead of fixed interest payments like conventional banks. and some brother here said that Lariba is doing haram stuff, but according to my limited knowledge what they advertise according to that they are totally halal and i wish they come to canada aswell so that i could get islamic mortgage, but might be he knows something about lariba that i dont know.

Well wat is Mehram and na mehram? its a simple concept, with mehram u can not marry (besides hubby who becomes mehram after u get married to him) and the hijab rules are soft (its not like there is no hijab) so if a woman who breast feeds u, now u will do hijab infront of him but the hijab would be same as u do infront of ur mother in law and sister in laws, and vice versa, so its not a compicated issue. its just the issue of respect and feelings, if someone bestows u something for any reason thats ur own mother is suppose to give u, then thats na-mehram lady deserves enough respect to be treated like ur mom.

Kal ko molvi mamu kehain gai ke fork se khana nahi khana, its haram cuz its a western invention :S
woh mulana Kishore Kumar noorani ne fermaya hai na ke

Kuch To Log Kahenge
Logon Ka Kaam Hai Kehna
Chhodo Bekaar Ki Baaton Mein
Kahin Beet Na Jaaye Raina
Kuch To Log Kahenge
Logon Ka Kaam Hai Kehna
ahemz

Islam only require u to wear clothes that are modest, cover ur awrah, and are lose enough not to reveal ur figure, thats it.

Didn mean to make it this long:s sorry but if anything sounds confusing just yell at me and i'll be back here.

Mirch

How is the LARIBA Model different from Other Models Used by Conventional Riba Banks and Mortgage Companies?

The Conventional Riba Banker and the LARIBA Finance Institution are first concerned with:
1. The ability of the borrower to repay by evaluating income and expenses of the borrower, and
2. The willingness and track record of the borrower to meet their commitments as reflected by the credit reports.
Then the process differs drastically.
For the Riba Conventional, if one qualifies the Banker will need to start by defining:
1. The Amount of the Loan,
2. The Number of Years of Repayment, and
3. The Rent of the Money, called Interest Rate. The profit he makes by renting the Bank’s money to the borrower.
The Conventional Banker inputs the above data in a computer (amortization) program and solves for the Monthly Payment consisting of Repayment of Principal and the interest on the money.
In contrast, the LARIBA Model starts by asking the homebuyer to:
1. Define the location, address and specification of the house they intend to buy,
2. Survey the rent of a similar properties in the neighborhood and come up with three independent estimates from reliable documented sources.
And the LARIBA Finance officer also gets three independent rent estimates for the same house.
This way, the buyer and the LARIBA Finance officer end up with 6 estimates of the rent. They then negotiate what they agree to as a fair rent for the property.
The following is a numerical example that clarifies the differences between the approaches used in riba (conventional) and Islamic financing:
A family wants to buy a house for $300,000. They only have $60,000 of the purchase price. They approach a bank to help them finance the house. The following is a comparison between how the process will likely go in a RIBA Banking setting as compared to Islamic Banking setting:
Riba Conventional Banker:
1. Evaluates the application form.
2. Concludes that the family derives a good income and that they have a good balance sheet. Also, the banker finds that the family cash flow can help them pay for a larger house or even to take a bigger loan without putting the $60,000 down,
3. Decides to lend the family at a certain interest rate over a period of time.
4. The repayment period defined by the banker can even be longer than necessary because the banker wants to help improve the family’s surplus cash flow. In fact, it also helps the bank derive more interest income from a good qualified family as the loan repayment is extended.
5. In fact, the banker may convince the family to buy a bigger and more equipped house. This is because the higher amount will represent a small addition to the monthly payment and it will be taken care of by prolonging the financing period (term of the loan).
Islamic LARIBA Banker:
1. Evaluates the application form.
2. Concludes that the family derives a good income and that they have a good balance sheet and good tax returns. In addition, the banker finds that the family cash flow is enough to cover the monthly payment for the house purchase.
3. Calls around to ask with real estate agencies such as Century 21, Caldwell Bankers the utility value of the home measured by the lease/rental rate.
4. Draws an agreement with the family that complies with the Islamic Finance legal requirements. In this agreement:
4.1. The family would own 60,000/300,000 or 20% of the house (20,000 shares at $1 per share) and the LARIBA Bank/Finance Company would (temporarily) own 80% of the house (240,000 shares at $1 per share.) In the same agreement the family agrees to buy the bank’s share of the car for the same value or $(300,000-60,000=) $240,000. This way the bank does not own the asset that complies with banking rules and regulations. The family, based on their cash flow agrees to buy the shares owned by LARIBA at the $1/share price and pay back the bank’s share interest free over a period of 30 years or $80,000 per year. This is called the Return OF Capital.
4.2. The family and the Banker, independently, survey the market to find a fair leasing rate for the house. They negotiate a fair lease and agree on it. Here the lease is divided between the family (20% in the beginning and rising to 100% over 30 years) and the Bank (80% in the beginning and declining to 0% over 30 years term.) This is called the Return ON Capital for the Bank.

4.3. The family and the Islamic banker, in order to satisfy the laws of the land, sign a promissory note, which documents the repayment of the debt (no time value of money) and the declining lease rate in a total monthly payment. In order to comply with the laws of the land, the Islamic banker inputs the monthly payments representing the lease rate and the Return of Capital into a conventional amortization schedule to figure the “implied” interest rate. This rate is disclosed to the client in order to comply with the “truth-in-lending” disclosure laws.
Please note that the resulting “implied” interest rate is not uniformly the same. It differs from one home and/or geographic location to another and it differs based on the leasing rate in the relevant market.
In the LARIBA Islamic Banking environment, the Islamic LARIBA banker encourages the family to pay their home off as fast as they possibly can in order to reduce the burden of debt on the family’s cash flow and free more money to save for the future.

More here:
LARIBA- FAQ