deedawar

^If you are not Gandhi then u must be a nice person..!

You still could not come up with a logical sensible answer!

Shogun Ninjuku

Why do you apply a Pakistani statistic of 5% to Indian population? I think his point was that homo practices are much higher in Pakistan than elsewhere due to factors such as separated madarssha schooling etc.

Now, don't come at me I am not the one who said it - ask your own guy who said that!

Seminole

google it, or are laziness and ignorance so intertwined to make that impossible? All major mental health organizations have stated that homosexuality is not a disease or mental disorder. You are obviously uneducated about this subject.
Yeah, like studying facts before spreading intolerance and lack of knowledge.

You showed no such thing except that you are judging people based on false pretenses, prejudice, misinformation and ignorance - surely a greater evil than what one does in the privacy of their own home.

Shogun Ninjuku

Guys,

Let's put the insults aside for a moment and be serious. Yes being around a gay guy will make me uncomfortable but that doesn't mean they should be treated as lesser people. We will never know with 100% certainty whether it is something they are borne with or due to environment or whatever. But I have come to believe that it is not something they are voluntarily doing - because how else do you explain their presence in all countries, all cultures, all religions, all times?

That doesn't mean it is the normal thing - no, I do not think it is normal. But let us not make cruel fun of them either.

And don't make this a muslim thing or a Pakistani thing or whatever.
----------------------------

Now sodomy and rape or 'keeping' of young boys by force etc - those things are unnatural, despeicable and must be stopped immediately. And from I am reading these are current sanctioned practices in parts of Pakistan and must be stopped. Please enter at least the 20th century, now that we are in 21st

deedawar

You mentioned mental health organizations.

It may be just me. But let me tell you Pshychiatry and psychology is ever evolving subject. It has no absolute.

Today what is considered right may not be considered acceptabe tomorrow.

What is definition of disease we must establish that.

A small percentage of people obviously interested in something against nature cfannot be considered 'normal'.

Any science or theory which tries to show illogical ideas of mind must not be correct.

Just because a lot is said on media and lot of money by wealthy sick gay people spending time and money on this topic does not make this act acceptable for majority natural people.

By the way Freud had wierd ideas about many things in phychiatry including suggestion of incest like thought between boy and his mother etc. so he is in my humble opinion a sicko himself. So please do not even try if any intention whatsoever.

Try meeting with psychiatrists...many of them are themsleves can be categorized into mental illness or suffering from personality disorders like delusion of *G*R-A-*N-D*I*O*s or obcession etc. (somehow I had to place stars so the word is not censored)

My point is that

..... mental disease definition is based on how many sick people themselves are defining it.


There is nothing in any of my post which can be regarded as intolerance for the people. Speaking out in the favor of normal behaviour does not mean intolerance.

Again, man with man and woman with woman may be good for sexual fantasy of a lot of people..even to watch them together..but its NOT and NEVER has been considered normal or acceptable.

Someday if large number of people come up holding playcards and newsworthy events and say they have attraction to animals to satisfy their needs......I bet these morons in psychiatry will not consider a disease.

Shamraz Khan

It may not be normal or acceptable, but its pretty much accepted fact now & all the studies have concluded that it is genetic & not by choice.

Also, homosexuality has also been witnessed in nature among animals. How do you explain that?

hareem01

Any reference? Because what I've heard is that it is not totally genetic.

It's common in monkeys, pigs and extremely rare in lions tigers etc.

CM

53 Muslim countries and close to the majority of the muslim population has it all wrong on Islam. But HSKhan has it all right. How could we not see it? HSKhan is the reincarnation of Jesus himself. What he says is by definition the word of God. Ignore the Quran, centuries of Shariah and rules. Ignore the fact that all muslims see Homosexuality as a crime.

Mind you if you support homosexuality and encourage it you ain't a muslim.

CM

Locate the gene. The entire Genome is mapped. Where is the gene sequence?

Seminole

All fields of study are evolving. Additional research, education and experiences mold these evolving interpretations. As has been pointed out, homosexuality exists in the animal kingdom, so it is not "against nature".

I find it illogical that there are people with fantastical beliefs of an illiterate man accurately delivering the final words of God by listening to an angel in a far away desert 1400 years ago. Just becuase there are a billion people today with those beliefs doesn't make it true, logical or disease-free. I'm sure you don't agree, but an unbiased person can easily interpret that mindset as illogical ideas of the mind. As you said "..... mental disease definition is based on how many sick people themselves are defining it."

In my country there are many times more gays than Muslims, so if we are basing what is "normal" or "accepted" by what the majority believes those definitions to be, homosexuals win out over Muslims.

soni27

^...

_Lahore_Ka_Cheetah

iPundit,
Couldn't you find a better source than Wikipedia?

I wouldn't be surprised if you wrote these articles yourself. I find it very unauthentic.

iPundit

If you want more sources Google it. I showed you the direction find your way :-|

Spock

bus kar pundit, bus kar!

_Lahore_Ka_Cheetah

Why should I google it?

If you want to argue about something, atleast get your facts straight by providing AUTHENTIC sources. Wikipedia is NOT an authentic source.

Mostar95

Mostly these are the cases of "raat gayee baat gayee" or "bachpan ki bhool" They do not become permanent gays.

deedawar

What is not normal as a behaviour is abnormal.

What is not acceptable in unacceptable.

Fair enough?

We are not talking about beliefs. We are talking about behaviour of people. Their inclination towards obtaining physical or mental pleasure by being "intimate" to another same sex human being.

You say it is genetic........OK I for the sake of agreement agree with you.

NOW

Let me ask you....

There is a large list of diseases which are genetically expressed and run in the family. Should we not call them disease?

So in essence all I want at least from you to see that being gay/homosexual is being diseased.

deedawar

Thank you for admitting what I tried to prove earlier.
Even phyciatry is not absolute and we are now using DSM fourth criteria of diagnosing mental disease.

Someone already mentioned its beyond being a mental disease.

Its a physical disease by virtue of being genetically determined...not entirely proven however...but goes along what so many heterosexuals are saying.

The notion of geneticaly determined is not so strong as even identical twins (made from same gene divided early on) may not be both homosexual!!!!

I do feel for these diseased people. They need treatment or behavioral treatment. Leaving them alone may be Ok as long as they are not being harmful to others. But they should still be considered diseased.

You have tried to give it a new twist.

What you wrote is not unexpected from you.

None of my post should be considered as I consider homosexuality wrong/ a diseased state of mind based on religion only.

You suggested I am intolerant of homosexuality.....thats again a misconception.


Again you brought religion or muslims in to discussion. A misguided argument.

Numbers has nothing to do with right or wrong.

All I said that accptable norm in terms of mental behaviour is based on large number of human behaviour over centuries over entire territory of the world.

(We are not talking about beliefs here..just to remind you)

A large number of convicted murderous people under one roof and few jailors in a prison does not make murder as acceptable act.

Seil

Pedophilia is allowed in Islam.



Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 16:
Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah:
While we were returning from a Ghazwa (Holy Battle) with the Prophet, I started driving my camel fast, as it was a lazy camel A rider came behind me and pricked my camel with a spear he had with him, and then my camel started running as fast as the best camel you may see. Behold! The rider was the Prophet himself. He said, 'What makes you in such a hurry?" I replied, I am newly married " He said, "Did you marry a virgin or a matron? I replied, "A matron." He said, "Why didn't you marry a young girl so that you may play with her and she with you?" When we were about to enter (Medina), the Prophet said, "Wait so that you may enter (Medina) at night so that the lady of unkempt hair may comb her hair and the one whose husband has been absent may shave her pubic region.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 3, Book 38, Number 504:
Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:
I was accompanying the Prophet on a journey and was riding a slow camel that was lagging behind the others. [...] When we approached Medina, I started going (towards my house). The Prophet said, "Where are you going?" I said, "I have married a widow." He said, "Why have you not married a virgin to fondle with each other?"[...]

Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3459:
Jabir b. 'Abdullah (Allah be pleased with them) reported: I married a woman, whereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to me: Have you married? I said: Yes. He said: Is it a virgin or a previously married one (widow or divorced)? I said: With a previously married one, whereupon he said: Where had you been (away) from the amusements of virgins? Shu'ba said: I made a mention of it to 'Amr b. Dinar and he said: I too heard from Jabir making mention of that (that Allah's Apostle) said: Why didn't you marry a girl, so that you might sport with her and she might sport with you?

How pathetic.

deedawar

Does this person who posted above know what sodomy means or what is being discussed here???

Its so obvious that the post above has nothing to do with if Islam allows sodomy or not.

Its your second islamophobic post. Hope someday you may eventually make sense.

What could be more pathetic than with your enthusiasm in talking bad about islam you forgot to make sense!!