• Accomplished
  • Aggravated
  • Amused
  • Angry
  • Annoyed
  • Anxious
  • Apathetic
  • Artistic
  • Awake
  • Bitchy
  • Blah
  • Blank
  • Bored
  • Bouncy
  • Busy
  • Calm
  • Cheerful
  • Chipper
  • Cold
  • Complacent
  • Confused
  • Contemplative
  • Content
  • Cranky
  • Crappy
  • Crazy
  • Creative
  • Crushed
  • Curious
  • Cynical
  • Depressed
  • Determined
  • Devious
  • Dirty
  • Disappointed
  • Discontent
  • Disgusted
  • Distressed
  • Ditzy
  • Dorky
  • Drained
  • Drunk
  • Ecstatic
  • Embarrassed
  • Energetic
  • Enraged
  • Enthralled
  • Envious
  • Exanimate
  • Excited
  • Exhausted
  • Flirty
  • Frustrated
  • Full
  • Geeky
  • Giddy
  • Giggly
  • Gloomy
  • Good
  • Grateful
  • Groggy
  • Grumpy
  • Guilty
  • Happy
  • High
  • Hopeful
  • Horny
  • Hot
  • Hungry
  • Hyper
  • Impressed
  • Indescribable
  • Indifferent
  • Infuriated
  • Intimidated
  • Irate
  • Irritated
  • Jealous
  • Jubilant
  • Lazy
  • Lethargic
  • Listless
  • Lonely
  • Loved
  • Melancholy
  • Mellow
  • Mischievous
  • Moody
  • Morose
  • Naughty
  • Nauseated
  • Nerdy
  • Nervous
  • Nostalgic
  • Numb
  • Okay
  • Optimistic
  • Pakistan
  • Peaceful
  • Pensive
  • Pessimistic
  • Pissedoff
  • Pleased
  • Predatory
  • Productive
  • Quixotic
  • Recumbent
  • Refreshed
  • Rejected
  • Rejuvenated
  • Relaxed
  • Relieved
  • Restless
  • Rushed
  • Sad
  • Satisfied
  • Scared
  • Shocked
  • Sick
  • Silly
  • Sleepy
  • Sore
  • Stressed
  • Surprised
  • Sympathetic
  • Thankful
  • Thirsty
  • Thoughtful
  • Tired
  • Touched
  • Uncomfortable
  • Weird
  • Working
  • Worried
  • User Tag List

    Results 1 to 13 of 13
    1. #1
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Afghanistan, a chilling story of bungling superpowers
      By Myra MacDonald


      NEW DELHI (Reuters) - They massacred the soldiers of the British Raj. They virtually exhausted the Soviet Empire. And now they are under suspicion in the biggest attack on the mainland of the United States, the world's sole superpower.

      If Washington decides to strike at Afghanistan for sheltering prime suspect Saudi-born dissident Osama bin Laden, it will be following others who tried to tame the Afghans -- and failed.

      "In addition to the natural hatred which every Afghan feels toward a foreign invader, there is a strong underlying current of fanaticism," wrote one old Afghan hand.

      "Unless promptly checked, (it) becomes at times, and especially against a Christian enemy, uncontrollable."

      That was about Afghanistan in 1880, written by British Field Marshal Lord Roberts, after ill-fated British invaders had been massacred in Kabul.

      The story of Afghanistan, an arid mountainous country at the crossroads of central Asia, is a chronicle of miscalculation. The British army tried twice to invade in the 19th century in a bungled attempt to build a buffer to protect India's borders.

      Moscow sent in troops on Christmas Day 1979 to protect its southern borders. Its retreat, at least 13,000 Russian deaths and nine years later, precipitated the collapse of the Soviet Union.

      And the United States supported the very people who may now be trying to destroy it -- helping Islamic militants, including Osama bin Laden, to drive the Soviet Union from Afghanistan.

      "The Russians went in without totally comprehending the implications of what they were getting involved in," said J.N. Dixit, a former Indian ambassador to Kabul. "America is reaping the results of its miscalculation also."

      THE GREAT GAME

      For many in the British Raj, the tangle with the Afghans started as a game, or the Great Game as it became known, led by eager, ambitious soldiers determined to make their names.

      They also had the missionary zeal of 19th century Christians who believed their desire to tame the wild Muslim tribesmen of Afghanistan was a battle of good over evil.

      Prompted by fear that Russia might seize control of Afghanistan, Britain decided in 1838 to invade.

      Twelve thousand men, 38,000 followers, and thousands of elephants and camels marched to Kabul to install a puppet ruler. But then came rebellion, and a disorderly evacuation in which thousands died, killed by tribesmen or by cold and hunger.

      Britain invaded again in 1878. This time the British resident of Kabul and his escort were killed by a mutinous mob.

      A century later, Soviet leader Leonid Brezhnev ignored those urging caution and invaded to back a leftist government in Kabul.

      Like the British before them, the Russians underestimated the complexity of Afghanistan, failing to see that support for the left in Kabul had no backing among the tribes in the countryside.

      "You cannot talk about Afghans as a single cohesive identity. They are fiercely autonomous people, not inclined to accept centralization," said Dixit.

      U.S. SUPPORT

      Fearing a spread of Russian influence into South Asia and even as far as the strategic oil-producing nations in the Gulf, the United States provided covert support to the Afghan rebels through its then main South Asia ally, Pakistan.

      But far from extending its power, Moscow became bogged down in a nasty guerrilla war in what was the Soviet Union's Vietnam.

      Reformist leader Mikhail Gorbachev ordered a withdrawal in 1988, but in doing so lost support at home and eventually his job. The collapse of the Soviet Union followed.

      The vast majority of Afghanistan is now controlled by the Islamic fundamentalist Taliban government, allegedly supported by Pakistan, the United States' erstwhile ally.

      Pakistan denies providing military support to the Taliban but is one of only three countries to have recognized it, along with Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. The Taliban has also denied bin Laden was behind the U.S. attacks.

      "There was a feeling of triumphalism among the jehadi (holy warriors) terrorists when the Soviet Union withdrew from Afghanistan," Indian defense analyst K. Subrahmanyam wrote in The Times of India Thursday.

      "Many of them, including ... Osama bin Laden, used to tell the Americans who trained him in special operations that the jehadis had defeated one superpower and thereafter it would be the turn of the other superpower," he wrote.

      12:17 09-13-01


    2. #2
      Banned
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Feb 8, 2001
      Posts
      1,381
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Against the soviets they had support from the US and Pakistan. It was not a singular Afghani effort.

    3. #3
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:
      Against the soviets they had support from the US and Pakistan. It was not a singular Afghani effort.
      Against the Brits they had support off...

      And further they have enough weapons left over from US and USSR to last them a few decades.

      If it was that easy US would have invaded Afghanistan long ago and took care of the monster it created. US knows what it is getting into thats why it needs NATO, Russia, China and Pak without their support US can only fire a few cruise missiles and hope for the best.

    4. #4
      Banned
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Feb 8, 2001
      Posts
      1,381
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Abdali:
      Against the Brits they had support off...

      And further they have enough weapons left over from US and USSR to last them a few decades.

      If it was that easy US would have invaded Afghanistan long ago and took care of the monster it created. US knows what it is getting into thats why it needs NATO, Russia, China and Pak without their support US can only fire a few cruise missiles and hope for the best.

      US is doing that because it is a civilized country.
      Afghanistan is a menace to China, Russia, India and even Pakistan. Why wouldn't they support the U.S.?


    5. #5
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:

      US is doing that because it is a civilized country.
      Afghanistan is a menace to China, Russia, India and even Pakistan. Why wouldn't they support the U.S.?


      Ah yes the civilised country which nuked civilians, killed millions in Vietnam and Korea and Iraq. Thats beside the point lets leave it for latter.

      This civilised country never gave two hoots when it invaded Granada, it gave no when it bombed the chemical factory in Sudan and launched cruise missiles on Afghanistan. Now suddenly it needs every ones support when it still could have done alone.

      Why change of heart...


      [This message has been edited by Admin (edited September 13, 2001).]

    6. #6
      Banned
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Feb 8, 2001
      Posts
      1,381
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      This civilized country saved the world from Nazis, saved the kuwaitis from getting killed, made saddam a eunuch, saved france's 5th republic, saved kosovars, gives the most aid in the world, even to oplaces like afghanistan who intrun lash out against it. Gives tho most loans. etc..etc....etc

      So if you going to compare the good and the bad. This portfolio analysis will turn greatly in black.

    7. #7
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:
      This civilized country saved the world from Nazis, saved the kuwaitis from getting killed, made saddam a eunuch, saved france's 5th republic, saved kosovars, gives the most aid in the world, even to oplaces like afghanistan who intrun lash out against it. Gives tho most loans. etc..etc....etc

      So if you going to compare the good and the bad. This portfolio analysis will turn greatly in black.
      This civilized country did not save Kuwait but smooth flow of oil. When did this civilized county stated giving a damn about some badowin on the other side of the world...just get out of ur fantasy world.

      US behaviour is open for discussion for some other time. Like usual you by passed the subject completely, how so very Indian.

      Here it is one more time...

      This civilized country never gave two hoots when it invaded Granada, it gave no when it bombed the chemical factory in Sudan and launched cruise missiles on Afghanistan. Now suddenly it needs every ones support when it still could have done alone.

      Why change of heart...


      [This message has been edited by Abdali (edited September 13, 2001).]


      Note from Admin: If Abdali's posts have to be edited one more time, please restrict the nick and contact Admin before releasing it.

      [This message has been edited by Admin (edited September 13, 2001).]

    8. #8
      Banned
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Feb 8, 2001
      Posts
      1,381
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Here's a post from another thread about the evil america:

      From an Indian web site
      All Indians in United States should appreciate this one. This, from a Canadian newspaper, is worth sharing.

      TRIBUTE TO THE UNITED STATES


      America: The Good Neighbor.

      Widespread but only partial news coverage was given recently to a Remarkable editorial broadcast from Toronto by Gordon Sinclair, a Canadian Television commentator.

      What follows is the full text of his trenchant remarks as printed in
      the Congressional Record:

      "This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the
      most generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth.
      Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out
      Of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of these
      countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.

      When France was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and
      swindled on the
      streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.

      When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries In to help. This spring, 59 American communities were
      flattened by tornadoes. Nobody helped.

      The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into
      discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent, warmongering Americans.

      I'd like to see just one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own
      airplane. Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the
      Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas DC10? If so, why don't
      they fly them?

      Why do all the International lines except Russia fly American Planes?

      Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on The moon? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy, and you get automobiles.

      You talk about American technocracy, and you find men on the moon-not once, but several times-and safely home again. You talk
      about scandals,and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everybody
      to look at.

      Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on Our streets, and most of them, unless they are breaking
      Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at home to spend here.

      When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through
      age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose.

      Both are still broke.

      I can name you 5,000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other
      people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced
      to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake.

      Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm one Canadian who is damned Tired of hearing them get kicked around. They will come
      out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to
      thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of those."

      Stand proud, America!


    9. #9
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:
      Here's a post from another thread about the evil america:
      Beating the same drum and by passing the issue at hand. As I said sooooooo very Indian.

    10. #10
      Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jan 28, 2001
      Posts
      396
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      all,
      Its quite simple. THe US in not going to attack Afghanistan, nor are they going to accomplish anything by killing, arresting Osama Bin Laden. Though I belive that his character is quite mythical, hyped by the media, there will be thousands like him if the issue is not addressed properly. Why are these damn terrorists so angry? Anyone answer that question. This new enemy is from within themselves. As for Invading Afghanistan, they will defeat the Americans if they try to invade Afghanistan. Hell...Pakistanis would love to have a chance to fight the Americans BUT ONLY IN WAR. And Pakistan has Nukes....Mad Mullahs With Nukes or MMWNs is not a nice idea.

      Now the thing is that actions like what happened to NY and Washington are a shame for mankind. They have a total dis-regard for innocent Human life and no political-agenda could ever support such actions. They shuold be condemmed not by one but by all. The culprits should be cought and hangged. For this I will stand behind the US. No one should be allowed to commit such acts. Imagine someone doing something like this in Pakistan. Well some Indians have been blowing up bombs in Pakistan for a long time now (Source:www.fas.org) but it is not right to do the same thing to them. ANYONE who kills innocent civilians should be killed and If Osama Bin Laden is involved I hope that the Taliban hand him over as well.



      [This message has been edited by Mursalin (edited September 13, 2001).]

    11. #11
      Banned
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Feb 8, 2001
      Posts
      1,381
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Abdali:
      Beating the same drum and by passing the issue at hand. As I said sooooooo very Indian.

      Abdali: If you hate America so much, why are you here? Yes, it is very Indian of me to feel loyalty to a country that gave my family a better life, access to education and never asked for anything in return. It is also very indian of me to now give back and support the decisions made by our leaders. It's a two way street, I for one will play my part.

    12. #12
      Senior Member
      ----
       


      Join Date
      Jun 12, 2001
      Location
      Mars
      Posts
      8,276
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:

      Abdali: If you hate America so much, why are you here? Yes, it is very Indian of me to feel loyalty to a country that gave my family a better life, access to education and never asked for anything in return. It is also very indian of me to now give back and support the decisions made by our leaders. It's a two way street, I for one will play my part.

      Go right to the top and start one line at a time and let us know where you slipped may be guppies will offer some help.


    13. #13
      ..:: Snake-Eater ::..
      ----
       

      Ali_R's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 10, 2001
      Location
      Sin City
      Posts
      14,544
      Mentioned
      0 Post(s)
      Tagged
      0 Thread(s)
      Originally posted by Infoman:

      Abdali: If you hate America so much, why are you here? Yes, it is very Indian of me to feel loyalty to a country that gave my family a better life, access to education and never asked for anything in return. It is also very indian of me to now give back and support the decisions made by our leaders. It's a two way street, I for one will play my part.
      If you love america so much why dont you go and fight on the side of the civilized country against the evil and uncivilized human race, the afghans?!
      Never asked in return?
      You dont pay taxes. Do you!?
      And if it is a better life now why you support INDIAN then? Must been the worst life for you there.

      Taliban was slipping out of U.Ss hand and secondly the trail story made it even worse. Everyone was seeking help from the States now they needed something special here.
      In fact they gave us a very special surprise.
      Didnt they?!
      Watch X Files, even if it contains fiction material it tells you a lot truth about INTELLIGENCE networks in AMERICA. And this is surely no fake.


      ------------------
      “Ishq bhi ho Hijaab mein husn bhi ho Hijaab mein. Ya tu khud Aaskhaar ho ya mujh ko Aaskhaar kar.”
      Ain't new ta this....HOMEINVASION('93)