happyheart

Did you read the whole article of mr. Baldev Singh P in USA?

Punjabee in USA

Yes, I did Why do you ask ? Is reading something in entirety a new concept for you ??

happyheart

Well u still did not tell me why u disagree with mr. Baldev Singh.
Only argument you said was that he is not worthy of having an opinion about mr. GAndhi?
If you read it then i think u did not understand anything what he said.

diwana

The article shows Gandhi was a bigot and racist.

Did anyone take the writer's challenge? He wrote a letter to Oprah but the letter is open to public.

If yes then what happened?

If no then why not? Afraid of him?

Arleitter

That thread had lost all its essence the moment it was established that Ayaz and Ghaznavi were gay partners but the interesting thing was that Ghaznavi despite being a gay,a looter and harmful to a holy family in Islam gained considerable support from you.That too with irrelevant and baseless comments,just because he harmed Hindus and a sect of Muslims.

diwana

^ lol, And they both were related very closely to MLK and Gandhi!

COLD_FIRE

- Someone comes and tells us that Mr. Arleitter is also as such, sould we just accept it blindly or not?

If not then, why u believe it in case of Mehmood and Ayaz. I haven't seen any fact from ur end. From any end. Derailing the thread was all what u guys could do.
The Historians agreed that the bond between them was far from the vulgar link that you are unable to come in terms with. A bond of brotherhood. Go on and dig mud, yet again. "cos I know, and I expect you to.

- Looter and harmful... yet again... no proper evidence. Historians have different point of views on Conquers and invaders, which are/can be debatable, but none has established that fact as well. And as far as I know, you are far from being any historian urself dear.

Cry babies !!!

COLD_FIRE

I keep getting that feeling of banging ones head on the wall.

While we like to talk substance, they talk of relevance. Its just not going anywhere.

Marasi_Dee

Feel free to open a new thread about that.

This thread is about Mohandas Karamchand's racism and Martin Luther King Jr.'s greatness.

Don't try to derail it with irrelevant posts.

happyheart

Well open whatever you want but do not discuss about other threads here pleeease
stick to the topic.

ravage

the author makes quite a few good points.

gandhi's main intellectual output, passive resistance, was copy pasted from better thinkers in the american transcendentalist movement like Thoreau. if he is considered a semi-decent thinker today, it is only because of the mass market appeal an indian audience readily provides. everyone panders to a large-sized demographic.

Victory

Gandhi was one and only one of a generation. This is what people think of him:

Mahatma Gandhi was assassinated on 30 January 1948, two days before the closing date for that year's Nobel Peace Prize nominations. The Committee received six letters of nomination naming Gandhi; among the nominators were the Quakers and Emily Greene Balch, former Laureates. For the third time Gandhi came on the Committee's short list – this time the list only included three names – and Committee adviser Seip wrote a report on Gandhi's activities during the last five months of his life. He concluded that Gandhi, through his course of life, had put his profound mark on an ethical and political attitude which would prevail as a norm for a large number of people both inside and outside India: "In this respect Gandhi can only be compared to the founders of religions."

Mahatma Gandhi, the Missing Laureate

Yes, In my view with all the controversies and drawbacks, Mahatma Gandhi ranks right besides the founder of religions like Buddha, Jesus, Muhammad Prophet, Nanak.

Controversies are part of the game and life. You name any great historical figure (religious, non religious, thinkers, scientists etc), I can find tons of material on the internet, who would have written against that individual.

He is not called the greatest man since Jesus Christ for nothing.

happyheart

yeah and i am Snow White!!

If i were you i would not shout "victory" too fast mate:



As opposed to the popular perceptions, here you will see Gandhi's image from the eyes of a very famous untouchable leader, named, Dr. B.R. Ambedkar (1893-1956). Born and raised as an untouchable, Dr. Ambedkar received his masters and Ph.D. from Columbia University, which later on also conferred upon him the Doctor of Law. Dr. Ambedkar also received a D.Sc. degree from London School of Economics, and the Bar-at-Law from the Grays Inn, London. Suffice to say, Dr. Ambedkar's sharp intellect has provided us an insight into Gandhi, some of which we will like to share with you all. We recommend the following:

1. Nichols, Beverley. Verdict on India. New York: Harcourt, Brace and Company, 1944.

A book we highly recommend. Beverley Nichols, a famous novelist, musician, playwright, essayist, reporter, and a journalist visited British India. During this visit, he met Dr. Ambedkar, who told him:

"Gandhi is the greatest enemy the untouchables have ever had in India."

So what did Ambedkar mean? Mr. Nichols explained it as follows:

[We can best explain it by a parallel. Take Ambedkar's remark, and for the word "untouchable" substitute the word "peace." Now imagine that a great champion..
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http://www.trinicenter.com/WorldNews/ghandi5.htm


You know who is: FREDRIK WILLEM DE KLERK??? He was President of the Republic of South Africa. He was part of apartheid that suppressed millions of people for centuries. He got nobel price . Gandhi can be placed in the same row, i dont mind.

Victory

Gandhi stood for unity of Hindus. He opposed separate electorate for dalits and hence Ambedkar and his followers did not like him.

Gandhi stood for unity of people across religions and castes, now many people did not like that view, like the hindu extremist Godse or the separatists like Jinnah.

Gandhi is unique because the Upper caste Hindus did not like him because they thought he supported the lower caste hindus and muslims. (He was assasinated by another Brahmin Godse). Few of the lower caste did not like him, because they thought he represented the upper caste. Few Muslims did not like him because he was seen as a practising orthodox Hindu.

If you want to get into the mind of Gandhi you need to live his life. A life which was truly an experiment with truths.

Yes he had his flaws, but which human doesnt have? There were many who might get a nobel, but the biggest non-violent figure after Jesus will be Gandhi.

You are trying to find justifications for your views on him, whether it comes from Ambedkar or from santa singh.

happyheart

Did you know that:

Gandhi’s desire for Indians to be segregated from blacks was so strong that he went to Johannesburg in late August of 1904 to protest the placing of blacks in the Indian section of the city.

Punjabee in USA

Gandhi became "Mahatma Gandhi" after coming back from South Africa. He was not born that way. What he experienced in SA shaped his personality. Why are you guys so obsessed with what he did when he was in SA ?

Marasi_Dee

^^ C'mon dude!

Mohandas Karamchand was a racist, why don't you just admit it?

Look e.g. at all the pictures he has taken in his life in SA. You'll not find a single Black there!

We just want to research history and not accept everything that media or indians would want us to believe.

Punjabee in USA

^ You can type the same thing again & again on this forum, but that does not change the way the world perceives Gandhi

ravage

^ like I said, much of Gandhi's lionizing has little to do with his intellectual output... the bulk of which wasnt novel and almost entirely lifted from Thoreau with minor modifications.

Victory

Gandhi's methods are not novel. That was the path many others had tread including Buddha, Jesus et al.

Gandhi was also influenced by many writers prominent among them being Leo Tolstoy. But, the greatness of Gandhi was he took the theory of those great thinkers and converted the idealogy into applicable format called Satyagraha.

When Martin L King came to India he came precisely to study and understand Gandhian application of the peace and non violence in day to day struggle against oppression.